27 replies to this topic

[TechMan]

Edit: Just saw your message below, GS... Here's the 2-year.

Edited by TechMan, 03 September 2010 - 03:43 PM.

[Gary Smith]

Thanks, but a 2 year chart would really show the trend up in this index since December 2008 bottom.

[vitaminm]

Do you think the data on barcharts are wrong?

Here is yahoo finance chart of vwehx

http://finance.yahoo...ource=undefined




Posted Yesterday, 03:33 PM
vwehx...bear trend since 1998

http://charts.barcha...v...KIC&org=stk
[/quote]


Thanks and reason why charts are completely worthless when it comes to bond funds, especially junk bond funds. VWEHX in a bear trend since 1998?? In fact, anyone who bought at the top tick on that chart is now sitting right at all time equity highs in their accounts.
Gary Smith Posted Yesterday, 03:09 PM

[Gary Smith]

[quote name='vitaminm' date='Sep 4 2010, 03:16 PM' post='541443']
Do you think the data on barcharts are wrong?


Below is a 10 year chart of VWEHX or at least the growth of a $10,000 account which is now at all time highs. Looks a lot different than what your charts would indicate doesn't it? VWEHX by the way is not one of the better high yield bond funds. As an aside, emerging market bond funds have tripled over the past 10 years. I have a chart of the H0a0 going back over 20 years but unable to post it. I sent you a PM if you are interested as I can forward the chart to you. This chart, a proxy for junk bonds, has gone up over 6 fold since 1991, far better than the stock indexes.


http://quote.morning.../f.aspx?t=VWEHX

[vitaminm]

May be morningstar is institution's darling and makes them look good!

Take a look at this site.


http://www.tickertec...?...none&other=



[quote name='vitaminm' date='Sep 4 2010, 03:16 PM' post='541443']
Do you think the data on barcharts are wrong?


Below is a 10 year chart of VWEHX or at least the growth of a $10,000 account which is now at all time highs. Looks a lot different than what your charts would indicate doesn't it? VWEHX by the way is not one of the better high yield bond funds. As an aside, emerging market bond funds have tripled over the past 10 years. I have a chart of the H0a0 going back over 20 years but unable to post it. I sent you a PM if you are interested as I can forward the chart to you. This chart, a proxy for junk bonds, has gone up over 6 fold since 1991, far better than the stock indexes.


http://quote.morning.../f.aspx?t=VWEHX

[Gary Smith]

[quote name='vitaminm' date='Sep 6 2010, 11:27 PM' post='541574']
May be morningstar is institution's darling and makes them look good!

Take a look at this site.


http://www.tickertec...?...none&other=



Complete misinformation as the chart shows an investor would have been in the red this entire decade until this year. Take a look at Yahoo, the Vanguard website or wherever it lists the year by year returns for VWEHX and you can see where the chart you show is way off base. It has had but two losing years this decade, 0.9% in 2000 and 21.37% in 2008. Even the dividends they show for the 10 year period is incorrect. The Morningstar site is 100% correct as to the growth of 10,000 in VWEHX. Do you really believe they would make that stuff up? You seem to believe per our PMs this is in a bear trend even though it was one new all time after after another in late July/early August and now sitting just a hair under those all time highs for any buy and hold investor camped out there. Price-wise a junk bond fund will always have a downsloping trend because of defaults in their portfolios. That's why the price (NAV) of this fund which went public at $10 in late 1978 is now trading at $5.60. But when you add in the monthly dividends during that time you would have multiplied your original investment many times over. VWEHX is not a fund I would ever recommend anyway because of its redemption fee for short term traders and its mediocre performance over the years compared to its peers.

[darnelds]

Thank you for sharing this information. I was not aware of such large discrepancies in reporting performance.

[vitaminm]

GS,

I can't reply PM.




"""The number of opening and closing quote tags does not match. Please fix this to submit your post.

This personal message has not been sent"""

I am getting this above message while I am trying to post.


I did notice that Tickertech calculation is not correct when it comes to adding dividend.

In all my charts above and below I am comparing price(NAV) without dividend.
One may get hungry for yield as long as principle is preserved.

http://finance.yahoo...ource=undefined

Edited by vitaminm, 07 September 2010 - 12:37 PM.