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COVID - New Assessment Not Good


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#11 claire

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Posted 12 March 2021 - 10:00 PM

hey claire, I am seriously interested in long term deleterious effects covid has left behind on younger and healthier people. If you have any links to respectable sources, I would appreciate getting them.

 

And my exercise routine goes back 5+ years, and  for18 years before that, I was playing 5 rounds of 18 on golf courses. My intent in posting it is simply to encourage many here to adopt an exercise routine. The benefits are beyond my expectations. I very seldom observe any people in Gym over age 70. And those same people I see in stores, barely shuffling along. No one needs to get weak and acquire bad balance resulting in falls due to age. I just mowed my entire lawn, front, both sides and back. And will visit the Gym later at my usual time between 8:45 & 9:00 PM.

 

This is not from genes, I can assure you. I was a physical wreck at age 55. All my uncles on both sides and dad never made it past 70. I am still here feeling energetic, athletic and needing zero medications at age 81 next month. The only difference is none of them exercised in old age. 

 

I am not claiming exercise will make one covid-proof.  But it never hurts to keep lungs in great shape, since it is a respiratory virus and usually establishes itself in your lungs first. Strong lungs will have a better shot at killing the virus than weak lungs. That is just my personal hypothesis and belief.

 

 

You're correct that exercise and a good diet are known to be very helpful in preventing or limiting ill health. However, some elderly people can't exercise because they may have a illnesses that seriously impede their ability to do much exercise. Also, it's not a matter of having good or bad genes that have an all-on-none effect on the whole body. Someone can have a genetic proclivity to one disease and not another. There may be genes that may make some people more susceptible to a severe covid response while otherwise healthy and protected from other diseases.

 

While Covid-19 often affects the lungs, it also may enter the brain directly via the sinuses or not damaging to the lungs but found in the blood and lymphatic system or in the bowels and affect any organ in the body via this route. Healthy lungs can't hurt, but people with asthma seem not to be more vulnerable, and many young people who are super-fit athletes die or can be serious impaired while some frail elderly people with multiple pre-existing conditions survive better.

 

The immune system and the human body in general are incredibly complex with much that is not understood. People respond to the same medicines differently or may have serious side-effects to some that work well for most people. In the next 50 years, current medical knowledge and treatment will probably be considered primitive. Meanwhile, there have been close to 550,000 deaths in the U.S from this illness and millions with serious on-going complications. Hopefully, much will be learned from the intensive investigations of covid that will help to understand and treat other diseases.

 

 

The following are some links to information about children, teens, and young adults who have serious covid illnesses. Included are links to Long-Covid or people who suffer from on-going damage to any number of organs and bodily systems. I've avoided articles that are highly  technical, but if interested, I can provide links to some of those.

 

 

Children with long covid - ScienceDirect

 

Younger Americans contracting Covid could face long-lasting impacts

 

Teen athletes with even mild COVID-19 can develop heart problems | Science News for Students

 

Younger Adults Caught in COVID-19 Crosshairs as Demographics Shift | Infectious Diseases | JAMA | JAMA Network

 

What are the long-lasting effects of COVID-19? - Harvard Health

 

Long covid- Damage to multiple organs presents in young, low risk patients | The BMJ

 

How coronavirus may trigger diseases from diabetes to MS - and damage the brain, too | Daily Mail Online

 

Can Long COVID Be Treated? - The Atlantic

 

Many Long-COVID Patients Are Struggling With ME:CFS Symptoms

 

As Their Numbers Grow, COVID-19 “Long Haulers” Stump Experts | Infectious Diseases | JAMA | JAMA Network

 

Neurological complications of coronavirus infection; a comparative review and lessons learned during the COVID-19 pandemic



#12 claire

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Posted 13 March 2021 - 11:35 AM

pdx5 - I was thinking of your wife when reading this article today. You've mentioned that she's been doing chemo for cancer (and likely immunocompromised) so this may be of interest to you:

 

https://www.washingt...covid-variants/



#13 Rich C

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Posted 14 March 2021 - 10:11 AM

Good discussion folks, I enjoyed!  I hit the gym 3 times a week before Covid.  For the last year, wife and I walk 1.5 miles, I go 4 days a week and do yard work 1 day.  I do a little work with two 15 lb. dumbbells.  I got my second shot and will return to the gym this week.  I'll look for a time that is not busy, maybe early in the AM.  I am sure they require a mask, and after I quit the gym I hear they took some machines out to achieve distancing, and they closed down the shower area since you could not wear a mask.  It will be interesting to see what the rules are now.


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#14 Rogerdodger

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Posted 14 March 2021 - 11:04 AM

Incredibly complex with much that is not understood.
 In the next 50 years, current medical knowledge and treatment will probably be considered primitive.

 

Recently, with the outbreak of the China Virus, medical dogmatism has ruled the day.

I find it curious that when this is pointed out and I call for less medical dogmatism and more open-minded humility, the cancel culture calls me anti-science.

 

(I was months ahead of the TV Showman Dr. Fauci  in pointing out the weakness of even the best masks, even my N95s. Recently he said we should wear TWO masks, after originally saying that the public had no reason the wear a mask. LOL!)

 

There is nothing more anti-science than a dogmatically closed mind and a belittling of questioning.

But it is easier than thinking, questioning, changing.

Open minded curiosity is the gold standard.

At least that is what Galileo thought, before he was imprisoned for thinking.

 

CLOSED-MINDEDNESS AND DOGMATISM 2,620,000 results

Published online by Cambridge University Press

 

Why it’s so hard for doctors to change   397,000,000 results

 

Why innovation in health care is so hard  297,000,000 results


Edited by Rogerdodger, 14 March 2021 - 12:09 PM.


#15 claire

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Posted 14 March 2021 - 12:23 PM

 

Incredibly complex with much that is not understood.
 In the next 50 years, current medical knowledge and treatment will probably be considered primitive.

 

Recently, with the outbreak of the China Virus, medical dogmatism has ruled the day.

I find it curious that when this is pointed out and I call for less medical dogmatism and more open-minded humility, the cancel culture calls me anti-science.

 

There is nothing more anti-science than a dogmatically closed mind and a belittling of questioning.

But it is easier than thinking, questioning, changing.

Open minded curiosity is the gold standard.

At least that is what Galileo thought, before he was imprisoned for thinking.

 

CLOSED-MINDEDNESS AND DOGMATISM 2,620,000 results

Published online by Cambridge University Press

 

Why it’s so hard for doctors to change   397,000,000 results

 

Why innovation in health care is so hard  297,000,000 results

 

 

Science welcomes questions and hypotheses that need to be rigorously tested to verify the findings. That's how science proceeds, based on reliable evidence, not untested or unverifiable pet theories and speculations - myths or quackery.  The methods of science are imperfect, but it's the best we have by far to advance knowledge. Of course, there are stumbles along the way, but science is self-correcting and always open to questions and adjustments. Scientific articles alway state what is yet unknown about their findings and the limits to which it applies.  Galileo was imprisoned for religious/political reasons -- anti-science.



#16 brucekeller

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Posted 14 March 2021 - 12:34 PM

Science can also be used. Look at what relatively small bribes from the sugar industry in the 60's did to popular science in regard to diet for DECADES, ending the lives of untold millions prematurely through the demonization of fat and that loading up on carbs was okay.

 

That's why I have a hard time trusting highly politicized science. There's a lot more at work than just some bribes. 

 

https://www.npr.org/...nt-blame-at-fat



#17 Rogerdodger

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Posted 14 March 2021 - 12:37 PM

Clue #1: Glasses fog when wearing a mask.

 

Clue #2: All humans have "religious/political reasons -- anti-science"

 

Clue #3: The earth may not be flat after all.

round-drops.jpg

 

Clue #4: Earth may not be the center of the universe.

Milky-Way.jpg


Edited by Rogerdodger, 14 March 2021 - 12:50 PM.


#18 claire

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Posted 14 March 2021 - 04:31 PM

Science can also be used. Look at what relatively small bribes from the sugar industry in the 60's did to popular science in regard to diet for DECADES, ending the lives of untold millions prematurely through the demonization of fat and that loading up on carbs was okay.

 

That's why I have a hard time trusting highly politicized science. There's a lot more at work than just some bribes. 

 

https://www.npr.org/...nt-blame-at-fat

 

 

Yes, I'm well-aware of the sugar industry's lobbying that led to this consequence, and there are numerous other examples of the corruption of scientific findings by those with a monetary or political agenda or hire scientists who work within the industry and confirm findings that benefit the industry. How about tobacco? That's an even more egregious example, and the approval of drugs that have not reached adequate standards of safety and effectivity. How about Purdue's oxycodone that has addicted and killed hundreds of thousands of people? How about corrupt scientists who falsify data to add publications to their resumes? It's one of the reasons that scientific advances take a long time and need repeated verification. I won't take a newly developed drug until it's been on the market for at least five years to allow time for concerns to emerge unless it's a life/death matter and no substitutes are available.

 

A healthy scepticism is always warranted, but how do you determine in advance whether scientific findings have been politically biased?  When there's a critical need to save many thousands of lives by vaccines that have been found so remarkably effective and which 95% of doctors take, and after 100,000 have received it in this nation with no deaths or serious consequences, and with the risk of Covid so much greater, will I wait five years? Absolutely not. Estimates of risk/reward need to be made with common sense and what leading scientists tell us. 

 

Or, is it reasonable scepticism when masses of people were dying all over the world to keep insisting it's fake news or no worse than the flu based on zero evidence or examples that are seriously flawed scientifically? How about all the unsubstantiated claims for faux treatments for Covid pushed by those with no evidence and even when contrary evidence existed? There are times that we need to rely on less than perfect evidence and go with the preponderance of evidence and expert opinions, especially in critical matters. Mistakes will happen, but that's not true for an overwhelming majority of the work of science. We'd still be doing rain-dances or exorcising evil spirits with an anti-science bias.



#19 12SPX

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Posted 15 March 2021 - 10:51 AM

Clue #1: Glasses fog when wearing a mask.

 

Clue #2: All humans have "religious/political reasons -- anti-science"

 

Clue #3: The earth may not be flat after all.

round-drops.jpg

 

Clue #4: Earth may not be the center of the universe.

Milky-Way.jpg

What really, not flat, that's hard to believe!!  swoon.gif