Funny thing, in Australia with home solar power, the need for new power stations has changed from 2013 to 2020 and with more installation will be extended to what?
Yep, this renewable energy is a crock.
A crock of gold!
The days of remote power generation is coming to an end.
Why pay for power when the technology is cheap and sustainable.
Every year the technology is more efficient and cheaper.
Soon every tile on your roof will be a solar cell or it will be here.
Solar power absurd
Started by
stocks
, Mar 06 2010 12:13 PM
184 replies to this topic
#22
voltaire
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Posted 02 September 2011 - 10:06 AM
So my next car will be powered for free.
All my household power will be free.
At the moment it may cost some thousands to install but recooped in several years.
This will become cheaper as the technology improves.
Hardly a new innovation as when I was a kid most people had windmills in my area generating all their power needs.
#23
stocks
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Posted 02 September 2011 - 11:30 AM
$535 Spent Million on Solyndra Solar Energy Firm in 2010; Firm Went Bankrupt Today; Pricetag $486,363 Per Job Saved for 18 Months
Investigators Probe White House Role in Massive Energy Loan
House investigators said they have uncovered evidence that White House officials became personally involved in an Energy Department review of a hot-button $535 million loan guarantee to the now-failed California solar company Solyndra.
"How did this company, without maybe the best economic plan, all of a sudden get to the head of the line?" Upton told ABC News in an interview this week. "We want to know who made this decision ... and we're not going to stop until we get those answers."
Solar
-- -
Defenders of the status quo are always stronger than reformers seeking change,
UNTIL the status quo self-destructs from its own corruption, and the reformers are free to build on its ashes.
Defenders of the status quo are always stronger than reformers seeking change,
UNTIL the status quo self-destructs from its own corruption, and the reformers are free to build on its ashes.
#24
stocks
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Posted 07 September 2011 - 01:44 PM
Why did it take so long to uncover the green jobs racket?
The Washington Post Explains
It seems like just a week or so ago when “green jobs” were still the rage. But in the wake of the Solyndra debacle, there is now a stampede to cough up the truth: It’s pretty much been a racket from the get-go. David Brooks is the latest to discover the scam
Green jobs, like any federal program, stick around as a plaything of government well past they’ve been shown to be a failure. That is the nature of government — a constituency forms, agencies are set up, and lobby groups arise. The pols and the bureaucrat defend the use of the taxpayer’s money, enlisting the media to run sunny stories about the “success” of the endeavor. It takes a very long time, or until a high-profile collapse, for the Potemkin village to come down.
Green
The Washington Post Explains
It seems like just a week or so ago when “green jobs” were still the rage. But in the wake of the Solyndra debacle, there is now a stampede to cough up the truth: It’s pretty much been a racket from the get-go. David Brooks is the latest to discover the scam
Green jobs, like any federal program, stick around as a plaything of government well past they’ve been shown to be a failure. That is the nature of government — a constituency forms, agencies are set up, and lobby groups arise. The pols and the bureaucrat defend the use of the taxpayer’s money, enlisting the media to run sunny stories about the “success” of the endeavor. It takes a very long time, or until a high-profile collapse, for the Potemkin village to come down.
Green
-- -
Defenders of the status quo are always stronger than reformers seeking change,
UNTIL the status quo self-destructs from its own corruption, and the reformers are free to build on its ashes.
Defenders of the status quo are always stronger than reformers seeking change,
UNTIL the status quo self-destructs from its own corruption, and the reformers are free to build on its ashes.
#25
stocks
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Posted 09 September 2011 - 10:44 AM
"Green jobs" - A total failure in Germany as well
Green energy used to be Germany's great hope for its economic future. But now the German solar industry is in trouble amid huge losses, job cuts and the threat of bankruptcies.
The situation is desparate in town of Bitterfeld-Wolfen, once nicknamed the "German Solar valley":
One photovoltaic manufacturer after another located in the area. The clean, future-oriented industry generated jobs and income, employing as many as 10,000 people in its heyday.
But now Q-Cells is struggling to survive. The company made a heavy loss in the second quarter of 2011. It doesn't take a business degree to recognize the desperate situation in which the company, once the world's largest solar cell manufacturer, now finds itself.
Solar Valley threatens to turn into a vale of tears. Mayor Wust fears that her town is heading toward another historic watershed. This time the fates of 3,000 workers are at stake
---
Now, of all times, the green industries of the future are faltering. The goal of developing a new leading industry with global aspirations has become a distant hope. German players play only a secondary role in global markets and are steadily losing market share -- despite being heavily subsidized. Or maybe the industry is ailing precisely because of the billions in government aid.
Hardly any other industrial sector has received such generous political support as the producers of green electricity, especially the solar industry.
Solar
Green energy used to be Germany's great hope for its economic future. But now the German solar industry is in trouble amid huge losses, job cuts and the threat of bankruptcies.
The situation is desparate in town of Bitterfeld-Wolfen, once nicknamed the "German Solar valley":
One photovoltaic manufacturer after another located in the area. The clean, future-oriented industry generated jobs and income, employing as many as 10,000 people in its heyday.
But now Q-Cells is struggling to survive. The company made a heavy loss in the second quarter of 2011. It doesn't take a business degree to recognize the desperate situation in which the company, once the world's largest solar cell manufacturer, now finds itself.
Solar Valley threatens to turn into a vale of tears. Mayor Wust fears that her town is heading toward another historic watershed. This time the fates of 3,000 workers are at stake
---
Now, of all times, the green industries of the future are faltering. The goal of developing a new leading industry with global aspirations has become a distant hope. German players play only a secondary role in global markets and are steadily losing market share -- despite being heavily subsidized. Or maybe the industry is ailing precisely because of the billions in government aid.
Hardly any other industrial sector has received such generous political support as the producers of green electricity, especially the solar industry.
Solar
-- -
Defenders of the status quo are always stronger than reformers seeking change,
UNTIL the status quo self-destructs from its own corruption, and the reformers are free to build on its ashes.
Defenders of the status quo are always stronger than reformers seeking change,
UNTIL the status quo self-destructs from its own corruption, and the reformers are free to build on its ashes.
#26
diogenes227
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Posted 21 September 2011 - 04:39 PM
"If you've heard this story before, don't stop me because I'd like to hear it again," Groucho Marx (on market history?).
“I've learned in options trading simple is best and the obvious is often the most elusive to recognize.”
"The god of trading rewards persistence, experience and discipline, and absolutely nothing else."
#27
stocks
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Posted 27 September 2011 - 04:17 PM
Green Math, a la Canada
Ontario’s green energy numbers don’t add up:
Wholesale Average Weighted Cost (YTD) of Ontario electricity: 3.35 cents/kWh
Guaranteed 20-year contract price per kWh for solar panels (ground level): 64.2 cents/kWh
Guaranteed 20-year contract price per kWh for solar panels (roof-top): 80.2 cents/kWh
Guaranteed 20-year contract price per kWh for wind turbines: 13.5 cents/kWh
Cost to the province in 2011 to reduce bills by 10% to hide increases caused by green energy programs until after the election: $1.1 billion
Ontario
Ontario’s green energy numbers don’t add up:
Wholesale Average Weighted Cost (YTD) of Ontario electricity: 3.35 cents/kWh
Guaranteed 20-year contract price per kWh for solar panels (ground level): 64.2 cents/kWh
Guaranteed 20-year contract price per kWh for solar panels (roof-top): 80.2 cents/kWh
Guaranteed 20-year contract price per kWh for wind turbines: 13.5 cents/kWh
Cost to the province in 2011 to reduce bills by 10% to hide increases caused by green energy programs until after the election: $1.1 billion
Ontario
-- -
Defenders of the status quo are always stronger than reformers seeking change,
UNTIL the status quo self-destructs from its own corruption, and the reformers are free to build on its ashes.
Defenders of the status quo are always stronger than reformers seeking change,
UNTIL the status quo self-destructs from its own corruption, and the reformers are free to build on its ashes.
#28
Rogerdodger
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Posted 27 September 2011 - 10:36 PM
What is hampering solar power has everything to do with cost.
It is five to eleven times more expensive to produce electricity from the sun than it is from coal, hydro or nuclear sources.
The first problem is with the cost of the technology.
The efficiency of solar cells is only about 22%. The rest of the sunlight that strikes the panel is wasted as heat. More efficient photovoltaic cells have been discovered but these are still in their experimental phase and are expensive to manufacture.
Giant solar farms have been built in desert regions and have reduced the installation cost since a larger economy-of-scale is created (parts, material & installation people are in one location). But these large, inexpensive tracks of lands are found far from cities where the power is needed. Expensive transmission lines are needed to bring the power to a distant market.
Maintenance costs are high since every inch of a solar panel must be kept clean and clear of debris. Their efficiency drops drastically even when a small portion is blocked by a leaf or a thin film of dust.
Child labor is the most economical way to keep panels clean.
The main problem with solar power that has stifled its use is the fact that energy production only takes place when the sun is shining.
Large storage systems need to be developed (these are environmentally damaging) to provide a constant and reliable source of electricity when the sun isn't shining at night or when a cloud goes overhead.
When solar panels are not producing energy, it takes longer to recoup their installation and maintenance cost. Countries that rely on expensive solar power will be at a severe disadvantage compared to ones that don't or can't use solar power.
Scientists need to discover more efficient semiconductors that are more efficient at electricity production.
Engineers need to develop more efficient production techniques.
New transmission technology is needed to bring the clean energy to market. Energy storage systems will also help smooth out the production bumps caused by climate and atmospheric interruptions.
Until all of these problems with solar energy are overcome, the promise of pollution-free energy from the sun will remain unfulfilled and marginally used in our society.
http://www.solarpowe...ar-energy.shtml
It is five to eleven times more expensive to produce electricity from the sun than it is from coal, hydro or nuclear sources.
The first problem is with the cost of the technology.
The efficiency of solar cells is only about 22%. The rest of the sunlight that strikes the panel is wasted as heat. More efficient photovoltaic cells have been discovered but these are still in their experimental phase and are expensive to manufacture.
Giant solar farms have been built in desert regions and have reduced the installation cost since a larger economy-of-scale is created (parts, material & installation people are in one location). But these large, inexpensive tracks of lands are found far from cities where the power is needed. Expensive transmission lines are needed to bring the power to a distant market.
Maintenance costs are high since every inch of a solar panel must be kept clean and clear of debris. Their efficiency drops drastically even when a small portion is blocked by a leaf or a thin film of dust.
Child labor is the most economical way to keep panels clean.
The main problem with solar power that has stifled its use is the fact that energy production only takes place when the sun is shining.
Large storage systems need to be developed (these are environmentally damaging) to provide a constant and reliable source of electricity when the sun isn't shining at night or when a cloud goes overhead.
When solar panels are not producing energy, it takes longer to recoup their installation and maintenance cost. Countries that rely on expensive solar power will be at a severe disadvantage compared to ones that don't or can't use solar power.
Scientists need to discover more efficient semiconductors that are more efficient at electricity production.
Engineers need to develop more efficient production techniques.
New transmission technology is needed to bring the clean energy to market. Energy storage systems will also help smooth out the production bumps caused by climate and atmospheric interruptions.
Until all of these problems with solar energy are overcome, the promise of pollution-free energy from the sun will remain unfulfilled and marginally used in our society.
http://www.solarpowe...ar-energy.shtml
Edited by Rogerdodger, 27 September 2011 - 10:42 PM.
"Nature's Failure to Function in a 'Predictable Way'... 500 years ago?"
BIGGEST SCIENCE SCANDAL EVER...Official records systematically 'adjusted'.
BIGGEST SCIENCE SCANDAL EVER...Official records systematically 'adjusted'.
#29
stocks
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Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:21 PM
Solar power absurd, a la Europe
The costs of Alex Salmond’s green energy revolution are “going through the roof” and threaten to bankrupt companies by doubling energy bills, business leaders have warned the First Minister. The Scottish Chambers of Commerce (SCC) said electricity is currently about nine times more expensive to generate from wind farms than gas-powered plants. It warned this would hold back the Scottish economy and lead to businesses going under.
–Simon Johnson, The Daily Telegraph, 29 September 2011
Poland would veto any EU legislation that threatened its sovereignty in energy policy, Maciej Olex-Szczytowski, an adviser to the Polish foreign minister on economics and business, said yesterday
–Bloomberg, 28 September 2011
In an age of austerity, cheap gas—domestically produced and available in large quantities—could be a major tool for restoring European prosperity. It allows EU member states to directly tackle their alarming growth of fuel poverty while providing a new means to help rebuild competitiveness. That is an investment no country in Europe can afford not to make.
–-Alan Riley, The Wall Street Journal, 30 September 2011
The shale boom of oil & gas is one of the few bright spots in the Obama economy. So it seems more than a bit paradoxical that Obama’s EPA and Department of the Interior continue working in attempts to find an excuse to shut it down — or at least slow it to a crawl.
–Al Fin Energy, 29 September 2011
energy
The costs of Alex Salmond’s green energy revolution are “going through the roof” and threaten to bankrupt companies by doubling energy bills, business leaders have warned the First Minister. The Scottish Chambers of Commerce (SCC) said electricity is currently about nine times more expensive to generate from wind farms than gas-powered plants. It warned this would hold back the Scottish economy and lead to businesses going under.
–Simon Johnson, The Daily Telegraph, 29 September 2011
Poland would veto any EU legislation that threatened its sovereignty in energy policy, Maciej Olex-Szczytowski, an adviser to the Polish foreign minister on economics and business, said yesterday
–Bloomberg, 28 September 2011
In an age of austerity, cheap gas—domestically produced and available in large quantities—could be a major tool for restoring European prosperity. It allows EU member states to directly tackle their alarming growth of fuel poverty while providing a new means to help rebuild competitiveness. That is an investment no country in Europe can afford not to make.
–-Alan Riley, The Wall Street Journal, 30 September 2011
The shale boom of oil & gas is one of the few bright spots in the Obama economy. So it seems more than a bit paradoxical that Obama’s EPA and Department of the Interior continue working in attempts to find an excuse to shut it down — or at least slow it to a crawl.
–Al Fin Energy, 29 September 2011
energy
-- -
Defenders of the status quo are always stronger than reformers seeking change,
UNTIL the status quo self-destructs from its own corruption, and the reformers are free to build on its ashes.
Defenders of the status quo are always stronger than reformers seeking change,
UNTIL the status quo self-destructs from its own corruption, and the reformers are free to build on its ashes.
#30
stocks
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Posted 02 October 2011 - 08:42 AM
Green Energy Industry Staggers
The political assumptions underlying the green investment boomlet turned out to be false. There will be no global carbon regime for the foreseeable future; there will be no cap and trade and no aggressive federal programs to raise energy prices during the deepest recession since World War Two.
Perhaps even worse from the green point of view, a cascade of discoveries and technological advances has dramatically increased the supplies of oil and gas in the western hemisphere — including huge new domestic energy supplies in places like Pennsylvania, Ohio and upstate New York. These discoveries are devastating to the politics of the environmental movement.
There will be the usual NIMBY-motivated opposition (some of it justified) to frakking and to oil and gas pipelines, but overall millions more Americans are going to be economically tied to domestic energy production and they will not want their congressional representatives voting against the industry on which their paychecks depend. Nor will they support presidential candidates who promise to eliminate their jobs. It will not just be the people who work in the extraction business who feel this way. Those who supply the industry, those who operate pipelines, those who sell goods and services to gas and oil workers: they will form a powerful phalanx of pro-oil and gas interests that will reach far beyond Texas.
At the same time, key environmental arguments will be seriously weakened. The western hemisphere looks set to become energy independent for the foreseeable future; the US is moving steadily away from the dependence on Middle Eastern oil that makes many national security experts think green. Importing from Canada just isn’t the same kind of problem as importing from Iraq.
energy
The political assumptions underlying the green investment boomlet turned out to be false. There will be no global carbon regime for the foreseeable future; there will be no cap and trade and no aggressive federal programs to raise energy prices during the deepest recession since World War Two.
Perhaps even worse from the green point of view, a cascade of discoveries and technological advances has dramatically increased the supplies of oil and gas in the western hemisphere — including huge new domestic energy supplies in places like Pennsylvania, Ohio and upstate New York. These discoveries are devastating to the politics of the environmental movement.
There will be the usual NIMBY-motivated opposition (some of it justified) to frakking and to oil and gas pipelines, but overall millions more Americans are going to be economically tied to domestic energy production and they will not want their congressional representatives voting against the industry on which their paychecks depend. Nor will they support presidential candidates who promise to eliminate their jobs. It will not just be the people who work in the extraction business who feel this way. Those who supply the industry, those who operate pipelines, those who sell goods and services to gas and oil workers: they will form a powerful phalanx of pro-oil and gas interests that will reach far beyond Texas.
At the same time, key environmental arguments will be seriously weakened. The western hemisphere looks set to become energy independent for the foreseeable future; the US is moving steadily away from the dependence on Middle Eastern oil that makes many national security experts think green. Importing from Canada just isn’t the same kind of problem as importing from Iraq.
energy
-- -
Defenders of the status quo are always stronger than reformers seeking change,
UNTIL the status quo self-destructs from its own corruption, and the reformers are free to build on its ashes.
Defenders of the status quo are always stronger than reformers seeking change,
UNTIL the status quo self-destructs from its own corruption, and the reformers are free to build on its ashes.
