4 replies to this topic

[Sentient Being]

Down 19.9% total return year to date and they finally warned they would take a loss. Moving yet another 500 million to loan loss, losing over 100 million in mortgages, no one is buying their paper and they are going to have to eat that.

All those little tricks they did to hold up the share price last time around are now coming home to roost.

Edited by Sentient Being, 10 September 2007 - 09:20 AM.

[humble1]

i have not followed them closely for a while. don't they also have a lot in annuities where the mark gives them the money and they give the mark a promise to pa ?

[skyymaster]

They (CNBC) were calling for all ceo's to come clean with their bloody balance sheet (Bloody part I added). XLF in trouble = SPX in trouble = Virus will spread to other sectors slowly but surely.

Edited by skyymaster, 10 September 2007 - 09:31 AM.

[Sentient Being]

I don't follow the fundamentals on WM but they have been able to maintain a level of share price by not coming out on any of this stuff. I think the recent homelender bankruptcy that put 1.3 billion of their at risk forced them to finally come clean a bit here. But how clean? How many more such losses? How bad will it get for WM? I'm not sure anyone really knows.

[nimblebear]

Big game of liars poker between all these guys. WM ceo wants the others to "fess up" now that he's played a few of his cards. I suspect many of these guys have a lot more fessing. and many probably don't really know how much that will be in terms of losses. I think we could still see people "fessing up" into '09. With over $400 trillion of notional value in derivatives out there, there has got to be more losses than we have seen so far. A lot more. This credit freeze up, is going to cause some major gut wrenching with players utilizing these derivatives.