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Who's NOT Buying This Rally?


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#11 TechMan

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 06:37 PM

... and I further guarantee that most will miss the first 15 to 20% down when it was clearly time to short it.

Hey nimblebear,

Yes, except for those who have continued to build up short positions in QQQQ, or the commercial traders who have continued to increase their short positions in the SPX.

Another thing I will guarantee is that we have not seen the lows in the indexes, and that the lows in March will be again breached...


The great Richard Russell of The Dow Theory Letters seems to think so as well. He wrote recently...

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As subscribers must know by now, I haven't liked the stock market. I can't tell with any certainty at this time, but this bear market rally could be in the process of topping out. If it is, I think we're in for a vicious collapse. Remember, rallies in a primary bear market are movements against the main force or tide of the market. In other words, during a rally, the bear forces have been held back. When a bear market rally breaks up, the market tends to make up for lost time. That means the declines tend to be rapid, violent and vicious. As I said, I can't tell with certainty whether the advance from the March low is breathing its last. But if it is -- watch out; it's not going to be pretty.

By the way, IF the advance from the March low is topping out, here are the implications. It would mean that all the Fed's machinations and efforts to halt the deflation have gone to waste. Furthermore, if the March lows are violated (and nobody believes they will be) we will probably be in the final and most costly and frightening leg of this bear market.
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#12 goldswinger

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 06:57 PM

"But if it is -- watch out; it's not going to be pretty." Hey, beauty is in the eye of the shortholder. it will be beautiful!! :)

#13 fib_1618

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 07:18 PM

And, I'm assuming that you pay no attention to the fundamentals, as per your comment above. I, on the other hand, pay attention to everything that I can get my hands on.

Well, not only do I pay attention to fundamentals, as a business owner for over 35 years, I am forced to face them day in and day out on many levels. In fact, I'm in an industry that was sacrificed by trade policies back in 1995. So for me to be bullish to any degree, while I see and feel an entire industry being decimated around me since that time, I myself am amazed that I can keep from screaming as loud as any bear that's either posted here or otherwise.

Fundamental statistics have been quoted for years, and because of this, many folks have lost the ability to create wealth from this same information. I suppose this goes back to the time to where man made his first trade between a spearhead and a stick, or a carcass and a flint, and provided data to show why something was worth more (or less) than before. The beauty though of technical analysis is that everything fundamental, without exception, is based on these same pieces of economic information that are not only known, but what statistically "should happen" given what we've learned from the past. This "analysis of opinion" gives us a way to cheat on what future fundamental expectations (fall out) will or can be given a constant (government stability, etc.).

Now, I don't know how long you've been directly doing this (for me, 38 years), but if you're in this business (or any business) long enough, you'll start to realize that the play is always the same, but the players are always different. It's sort of like fashion...when see kids wearing the same thing you wore when you were his or her age and they call it "new", and you just have to smile as you've seen it all before. Nothing different here too.

Now, you, arb and others are really sticking your collective necks out right now in the face of ever increasing liquidity levels that causes many boats to rise with this same tidal effect. I, for one, highly appreciate your sharing of these views as it provides the board with necessary balance. But your use of already known fundamentals to justify your bearish stances may be hurting your objectivity more than helping to state your case on a public forum. Granted, you might be right, but it's in the area of timing that separates the wheat from the chafe as far as making your points relative to this same wealth creation medium, no less, being sucked into a whirlpool of disenchantment.

On a technical basis, however, there is just too much buoyancy in the marketplace to be looking for a top of any significance at this time. It could be a month from now, or it might be a year from now. Realistically, no one really knows the future be it a human, dog or worm. We can only speculate on this kind of expectation. However, just like in fundamental analysis, there are also constants when it comes to technical analysis as well. And it is from this area from where I come from. I have learned over time to respect the art of Technical Analysis as being of utmost importance in trying to separate the emotion that distractions cause (the wheat) from what's truly consequential (the chafe) in bettering ones trading account's bottom line. If things change, I will share that as well as I believe it's important to make as much money as we can, when we can. Whether prices move higher or lower makes absolutely no difference to me (nor it should to anyone else) as we have many products out there these days that can take advantage of any or all future situations that are presented.

I hope you took this post in the positive spirit in which it was intended, and may 2010 be profitable year for you and for everyone reading this.

Fib

Better to ignore me than abhor me.

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"Beware of false knowledge; it is more dangerous than ignorance" - George Bernard Shaw

 

Demagogue: A leader who makes use of popular prejudices, false claims and promises in order to gain power.

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#14 Jnavin

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 07:21 PM

A Whirlpool of Disenchantment -- Fib, do you mind if I use that as the title of my next novel?

#15 fib_1618

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 07:33 PM

A Whirlpool of Disenchantment -- Fib, do you mind if I use that as the title of my next novel?

It does have poetic vibe to it, doesn't it?

Sure...just give me a one line credit in the forward. :D

Fib

Better to ignore me than abhor me.

“Wise men don't need advice. Fools won't take it” - Benjamin Franklin

 

"Beware of false knowledge; it is more dangerous than ignorance" - George Bernard Shaw

 

Demagogue: A leader who makes use of popular prejudices, false claims and promises in order to gain power.

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#16 TechMan

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 07:40 PM

But your use of already known fundamentals to justify your bearish stances may be hurting your objectivity more than helping to state your case on a public forum.


But Fib, Using the "already known" data is all that everyone's doing here. What is not known will not be known till it happens.

While I do, indeed, appreciate your essay, I have to ask what is it out there that's not already known to the market, technically or fundamentally. Fib, that's all we do, hashing over KNOWN data from the known past trying to gain some insight into the unknown future. And, our individual interpretation of these data have always been objective. That's why we have such a divide between the bulls and the bears right on this board.

I'm sure you're as frustrated as I am, and for the life of you and me, that the other camp simply couldn't see all the writing's on the wall. It couldn't have been more clearly defined technically and fundamentally, for me, that we're at a very critical juncture of a bearish reversal. It's as clear to me as night and day. And I've posted various technical as well as fundamental charts to assert my observation.

I too hope that you don't take this the wrong way...

#17 TechMan

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 08:18 PM

our individual interpretation of these data have always been objective


Correction: I meant Subjective... Well, I'm sure y'all know what I meant. When it comes to human, it's nearly impossible to interpret any data Objectively. We choose to see what we want to see and ignore what we don't want to see.

#18 fib_1618

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 08:20 PM

But Fib, Using the "already known" data is all that everyone's doing here. What is not known will not be known till it happens.

The market is a discounting mechanism. Money searches out areas of investment that the majority doesn't realize as being important (under valued) and is put to work. Since we're dealing with bigger sizes of money than you or I have to work with, no less from areas from which this money has a heavy hand in creating economic substance, it then becomes absolutely key for all of us to just follow its direction. What is not known now will be known in time. Waiting for this information to be read in the papers has already been discounted by this same mechanism (for example, the unemployment data of last month was already discounted by the market as early as July). How the market does this as consistently as it does is still a question I don't have an answer to, but it does provide this insight on a consistent basis and that's all it counts. It's also why many are here as these same folks have seen these signs of rhythm that doesn't match up with the facts. Believe me, there will be plenty of time to move in the opposite direction, and if I may be so bold, it will likely come just when the majority believes that we won't go lower just like they did in 2007...a time in which even the staunchest of bears for 4 years prior suddenly turned bullish. This, above all else, was our cue to be cautious and let the market work its magic to once again cleanse the system so that a new beginning could emerge.

Fib

Better to ignore me than abhor me.

“Wise men don't need advice. Fools won't take it” - Benjamin Franklin

 

"Beware of false knowledge; it is more dangerous than ignorance" - George Bernard Shaw

 

Demagogue: A leader who makes use of popular prejudices, false claims and promises in order to gain power.

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#19 TechMan

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 08:31 PM

Waiting for this information to be read in the papers has already been discounted by this same mechanism


It's more like newswire via the Net nowadays. So, we're on the same page about the best that we could ever do, short of having the ability to see the future, is interpreting the known data from the known past trying to project the unknown future.

#20 goldswinger

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 08:55 PM

Waiting for this information to be read in the papers has already been discounted by this same mechanism


It's more like newswire via the Net nowadays. So, we're on the same page about the best that we could ever do, short of having the ability to see the future, is interpreting the known data from the known past trying to project the unknown future.


Even so, you can only guess the known unknowns vs the unknown unknowns to use a previous line from a famous mass murderer.

GS.