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#1 csw2002



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Posted 24 July 2015 - 03:32 PM

As many of you know, Dennis Leontyev (handle name Denleo), purported hedge fund manager in Chicago, has been active on Traders Talk for a decade now. He has claimed to have a successful career in trading and supposedly manages a $50M fund. In 2014, he promised to take on traders, upon successfully completion of his training course, who will be funded with a $50K trading account. Here is the detail of the original post initiated by Mark on Dennis' behalf with Dennis' own posts following Mark's:

I signed on Dennis' program on the basis of the above post and paid Dennis $10K for the privilege. I am not blaming Mark for it as the decision to join Dennis' program was mine and mine alone.

Every interaction between myself and Dennis is via either email or skype calls. Hence everything I am presenting here is backed up by documentations. Dennis is aware that I recorded the skype calls so that I can review his mentoring sessions if necessary.

Initially Dennis provided a set of videos on option trading and pair trading on his wisetradechat.com website. While I was somewhat disappointed in the contents as they were literally copy and paste from sites such as OptionMonster.com (from charts to text), I took them and passed the exams with flying colours. I even notified Dennis that some of the questions had incorrect answers and he acknowledged that they would be fixed up going forward. Dennis and I also scheduled 1 on 1 mentoring sessions once a week via skype. Again, I didn't find a lot of value in these sessions, I was patient and looking forward to some "nuggets" that I could pick up along the way. By late Oct 2014, Dennis advised that I was ready to trade his account and he would advise once the account is ready. He didn't schedule any further training and promised more sessions in the new year as well as new education videos on his website. The new year rolled around and still no further interaction from Dennis. I sent a number of emails and skype messages and his response was that he was busy and would advise of changes. He also discontinued his regular market updates that were supposed to be part of the program. Feb, Mar and Apr 2015 came around with no further progress other than that he was still working on opening these trading accounts. A SureTrader account was opened and closed within one week in Apr 2015 as the account could not trade option spread. Finally, in May 2015, a TOS trading account was provided. To my surprise, instead of $50000, it only had $2500. The stipulation for operating the account was that no more than $1000 was allowed for each trading position and account equity has to stay above $500. The account can only be used to trade options long or spread. While I was a bit surprised, I surmised that this was a merely a training account to ensure new graduates from Dennis' program would learn to walk before run. However, by June, while operating the account well within the parameters specified, I learned from Dennis' risk manager that this $2500 account is the only one I am ever going to get.

Upon learning this piece of information, I immediately asked Dennis what is going on as this is not what was originally agreed on. He simply refused to engage me on this specific topic despite my numerous emails to him and instead referred me to his risk manager who rightly stated that he did not participate in the original agreement and couldn't do anything about it. I pointed out both to Dennis' risk manager and Dennis himself that at 2% risk, a $2500 account would only allow $50 risk per trade, including commission. I would never have signed on to Dennis' program for a $2500 account and I would never operate a $2500 account as it would not be sustainable. I pointed out to Dennis that typical risk one assumes in individual position should be around 0.5% to 1%. While 2% is OK for the risk tolerant, at $50 per trade, it would never work, especially not for option trades. I advised Dennis that if he could not continue with the original agreement, he should refund the $10K I paid him.

Unfortunately, Dennis continued to ignore both my emails and phone calls. Finally I reached him on 29th June (by suppressing my Caller ID) I took issue with him in relation to the account and his response was that I had the trading account a few months and wasn't making any progress. I pointed out to him that (1) I only had an account for 1 month and operating within the specifications (2) the account size is not sufficient for any practical type of trading and (3) our agreement is for a $50000 account. On (1), he promised to get back to me and on (2) and (3), he had no answers. He finally asked me to give him another 48 hours to respond and I agreed. Wednesday (1st July) came and went and Dennis was not responding to my phone calls or emails. Finally on 3rd July, Dennis asked me to contact his compliance manager in NYC which I duly did. Again, it went nowhere as the compliance manager trotted out the same lines as Dennis and completely ignored the agreement for the $50K trading account.

Given the sequence of events, I feel I must conclude that Dennis has no intention of honouring our agreement while keeping the money I paid him for it.

I am dissatisfied and disappointed with my experience with Dennis and feel as though I was misled. I urge anyone considering a similar proposition to examine the above linked documentation and see if you come to the same conclusion.
Don't be a fool like me - How I lost $10K

#2 gannman



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Posted 24 July 2015 - 04:05 PM

wow sorry to hear that man. that just isnt right and u had a lot more patience than i would have had
feeling mellow with the yellow metal

#3 viccarter



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Posted 24 July 2015 - 04:38 PM

Man I am really sorry to hear about this, bro. Honestly, when I read the little flyer, something sounded off. Why would a guy give 50K in the future for 10K in the present? It just seemed off. At least you got 2500 of it back.

#4 lip11



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Posted 24 July 2015 - 04:43 PM

wow csw, that is terrible. Dennis is completely wrong and you were indeed misled. You deserve the full 10k refund. Something should be done. I sincerely hope this is resolved to your complete satisfaction. Your patience is incredible. So sorry you went through this.

#5 cp1



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Posted 24 July 2015 - 04:49 PM

WOW...I am so sorry to hear about this. I did not expect this from Dennis. It's almost like a Nigerian scam Hope you get your money back.

#6 risk_management



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Posted 24 July 2015 - 05:06 PM

Sorry to hear that csw, you seem like a nice guy. I wonder how many others are out there who have been too taken for a ride. Probably too ashamed to divulge and come forward.

#7 csw2002



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Posted 24 July 2015 - 05:28 PM

Man I am really sorry to hear about this, bro. Honestly, when I read the little flyer, something sounded off. Why would a guy give 50K in the future for 10K in the present? It just seemed off. At least you got 2500 of it back.

Well, the $2500 wasn't in my name and of course it has since been deactivated and I won't see a cent in that account given how things are going. The idea behind a $50K account was to share profit generated and I didn't think it was such a far-fetched idea at the time given it is how a lot of prop shops work.

Edited by csw2002, 24 July 2015 - 05:38 PM.

Don't be a fool like me - How I lost $10K

#8 tradesurfer



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Posted 24 July 2015 - 05:37 PM

Maybe you should contact the SEC or pursue small claims court for breach of contract

#9 MDurkin



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Posted 24 July 2015 - 06:25 PM

Those that can do, those that can't teach, those that can do neither..... fill in the blank.

#10 dasein



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Posted 24 July 2015 - 07:24 PM

csw - I am really disappointed - sad for you but also Dennis - I really did not think he would do anything underhanded. If this is the mess you say it is - I hope you have a countersigned copy of your agreement. I would take that to a lawyer since the concept is not a clear P&S agreement, and if it is $40K you cant go to small claims - I just read the detaol post - that is sortof a labor contract so that may make it more complicated. If the agreement was with an LLC dont waste your money - it is nearly impossible to get money out of an LLC. I remember reading that offer - I thought about it myself but did not feel I was talented enough - contrary to Mark - I have heard of other places making similar offers - to me it makes sense, after all, the turtle traders were even trained for free. Lastly, I would say - you have been really patient - but have a lawyer read your contract terms- there is still hope to me that it is some kind of misunderstanding.