48 replies to this topic

[claire]

I notice nobody has attempted to debunk the CCCA analysis. Show me that the distortions aren't all on the part of Pfizer. There's a text version if you prefer not to watch the video presentation.

 

Send the text.  I don't watch videos.

In response to the article about the Israeli doctor's comments about one hospital's covid patients, this is not what the stats from Israel show and very few details are in this article -- eg for which period of time this is true, ages of patients, how many patients,

etc. 

[hhh]

Here you go claire: https://www.canadian...Dec-16-2021.pdf

Thank you.

Edited by hhh, 04 February 2022 - 09:58 AM.

[claire]

Here you go claire: https://www.canadian...Dec-16-2021.pdf

Thank you.

 

UGH! I'm regretting that I committed to reviewing this information. I hardly know where to begin. First of all, I had to blow up the PDF file 100% to see the tiny print on the right side of their pages for the data upon which they make sweeping conclusions in bold print that are seriously fallacious or misleading and don't align with their conclusions.

 

Further, they place demands on the initial study that are unreasonable for any such undertaking in similar circumstances when death rates were soaring, hospitals and health care professionals were being overwhelmed and at the brink of chaos. and when their initial findings were quite remarkably free of severe adverse effects and with the highest levels of efficacy achieved for any vaccine.

 

As an aside, yes, there really were freezer trucks lined up outside hospitals for the dead bodies that couldn't be sent to already filled morgues in NY, and there wasn't sufficient PPE for hospital staff who used garbage bags instead of hospital gowns and reused masks repeatedly while hospitals were scrambling to find ventilators for the patients who were dying. NY was hit first and hit hard, and it was on its way all over the country as the internet was already being flooded with videos saying it's not worse than the flu, that there would be fewer deaths than for the flu or that it's all a lie -- a plot by dark forces to control people.

 

Before even getting to the data presented in the link about Pfizer, it's important to understand that any treatment, procedure, and medication can and does have side effects for some people, including what is considered rare adverse effects or deaths. Having a simple suture for a cut can lead to infection and sepsis, but the risk/reward is highly skewed to a favorable outcome and avoiding much more likely adverse effects if a wound is left open. There are rare adverse effects for every medical procedure performed.

 

This is also true for every medication that is considered extremely safe. For many treatments and medications, the rates of adverse effects may be very high, such as occurs for chemotherapy, but the odds are still favorable for treatment. If you look up a medicine and read the section "reserved for professionals," you'll find the list of adverse effects and that 1/1000 for such an effect is considered rare.  I'm sure just about everyone older than 50 has taken many more than one such medication without even thinking about it. 

 

If you were to scrutinize the the data for all our routine vaccinations, you'd also find rare adverse effect all of them and object to all of them. 

 

As an example, here are the adverse effects from the DPT vaccines:

 

ADVERSE EVENTS OCCURRING WITHIN 48 HOURS OF DTP (diphtheria and tetanus toxoids and pertussis vaccine adsorbed usp) VACCINATIONS

Event

Frequency*

Local   Redness

1/3 doses

Swelling

2/5 doses

Pain

1/2 doses

Systemic   Fever > 38°C (> 100.4° F)

1/2 doses

Drowsiness

1/3 doses

Fretfulness

1/2 doses

Vomiting

1/15 doses

Anorexia

1/5 doses

Persistent, inconsolable crying (duration > 3 hours)

1/100 doses

Fever ³ 40.5°C (³ 105° F)

1/330 doses

Nervous System   Collapse (hypotonic-hyporesponsive episode)

1/1,750 doses

Convulsions (with or without fever)

1/1,750 doses

Rarely, an anaphylactic reaction (i. e., hives, swelling of the mouth, difficulty breathing, hypotension, or shock) and death have been reported after receiving preparations containing diphtheria, tetanus, and/or pertussis antigens

 

Nervous System

The following neurologic illnesses have been reported as temporally associated with vaccine containing tetanus toxoid: neurological complications 21,22 including cochlear lesion, 23 brachial plexus neuropathies, 23,24 paralysis of the radial nerve, 25 paralysis of the recurrent nerve, 23 accommodation paresis, and EEG disturbances with encephalopathy. 19 The report from the IOM suggests that there is a causal relation between Guillain-Barré syndrome (GBS) and vaccines containing tetanus toxoid. 26 In the differential diagnosis of polyradiculoneuropathies following administration of a vaccine containing tetanus toxoid should be considered as a possible etiology. 19,27

Short-lived convulsions (usually febrile), or collapse (hypotonic-hyporesponsive episode) occur infrequently and appear to be without sequelae. 2

 

More severe neurologic events, such as a prolonged convulsion, or encephalopathy, although rare, have been reported in temporal association with DTP (diphtheria and tetanus toxoids and pertussis vaccine adsorbed usp) administration. An analysis of these data failed to show any cause and effect association. 2

 

Cardiovascular System

An infant who developed myocarditis several hours after immunization has been reported. 32

Respiratory System

Respiratory difficulties, including apnea, have been observed.

 

And - for BCG VACCINES (Tuberculosis)

Although BCG vaccination often causes local reactions, serious or long-term complications are rare.{3} Reactions that can be expected after vaccination include moderate axillary or cervical lymphadenopathy and induration and subsequent pustule formation at the injection site; these reactions can persist for as long as 3 months after vaccination. More serious local reactions include ulceration at the vaccination site, regional suppurative lymphadenitis with draining sinuses, and caseous lesions or purulent draining at the puncture site. These manifestations might occur up to 5 months after vaccination and could persist for several weeks. The intensity and duration of the local reaction depends on the depth of penetration of the multiple puncture device and individual variations in patients' tissue reactions. Slight tenderness at the puncture site may be encountered as well as some itching. The initial skin lesions usually appear within 10–14 days and consist of small red papules at the site. The papules reach maximum diameter (about 3 mm) after 4 to 6 weeks, after which they may scale and then slowly subside.

The most serious complication of BCG vaccination is disseminated BCG infection.{24,25} The most frequent disseminated infection is BCG osteomyelitis (0.01 to 43 cases per million doses of vaccine administered) which usually occurs 4 months to 2 years after vaccination. Fatal disseminated BCG infection has occurred at a rate of 0.06–1.56 cases per million doses; these deaths occurred primarily among immunocompromised persons.

The safety of BCG vaccination in HIV-infected adults and children, including infants, has not been determined by controlled or large studies. This is a concern because of the association between disseminated BCG infection and underlying immunosuppression. Individuals with HIV infection should not receive the BCG Vaccine.{3}

 

Check out the adverse effects of the SMALLPOX vaccine - more extensive than for DPT and BCG - and for ANY other vaccine.

While there are people who oppose all vaccinations based on some of these rare findings, most people alive today are blissfully unaware of the death tolls for these diseases prior to vaccinations. My mother's only two siblings died of diptheria. The mortality rate from these and other such diseases were terrifying. We may know more about the terrifying disabilities and deaths caused by polio. Few remember smallpox.

 

I strongly recommend that you read this article:  "Why it's important to look at the 'bigger' picture..."

 

https://www.abc.net....jEAvEbNiw2WOnHs

 

hhh, I haven't had time to discuss the Pfizer article you linked. This took me longer than I expected, but I think it's important. I hope to get to that later.

 

claire

 

[Rogerdodger]

Breaking News:

As the world continues to battle the ongoing pandemic, Chinese scientists from Wuhan have issued a warning against a new variant of coronavirus named NeoCoV, which is said to be more lethal with a higher infection rate.

 

Who knew that the WUHAN Plan was the new Soylent Green?

 

The truth from 3,000 years ago:
"Our lives last seventy years or, if we are strong, eighty years. Even the best of them are struggle and sorrow; indeed, they pass quickly and we fly away."

According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, average life expectancy in the U.S. is 78.6 years—76.1 years for men and 81.1 years for women.
But then, in the first half of 2020, they crammed Covid patients in nursing homes and the average U.S. life expectancy dropped according to a new report from the National Center for Health Statistics, a part of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

Also, a surge of drugs crossing our southern border, along with multitudes of unchecked  people who were bused all across the country, insured that overdose deaths, along with diseases were a part of the decline in life expectancy in the U.S.
And there is this: During February 21–March 20, 2021, suspected suicide attempt ED visits were 50.6% higher among girls aged 12–17 years than during the same period in 2019; among boys aged 12–17 years, suspected suicide attempt ED visits also increased by 3.7%.

Wear your seat-belt.
Don't text and drive.
Don't drink and drive.
You might just make it to 80, or even more, alone in a nursing home, incapacitated and heavily medicated.

 

PS: Several of my ancestor-relatives made it to 100 or near there. Others died younger and the average is just below 80, as now and is written.

Edited by Rogerdodger, 05 February 2022 - 06:40 PM.

[claire]

Breaking News:

As the world continues to battle the ongoing pandemic, Chinese scientists from Wuhan have issued a warning against a new variant of coronavirus named NeoCoV, which is said to be more lethal with a higher infection rate.

 

Who knew that the WUHAN Plan was the new Soylent Green?

 

 

 

What is known so far about this new variant of concern found in bats - NeoCoV:

 

It originated in South Africa.

 

It is NOT a new Covid-19 variant. Rather, it's linked to the MERS-CoV virus that had outbreaks in the ME during 2012-15 with a very high case fatality ratio (35% deaths) but did not spread as easily as Covid-19.

 

So far, NeoCoV has infected only bats but has the potential to infect people if there are further adaptations.

 

Since MERS-related viruses interact with surface cell proteins differently than Covid-19, antibodies for Covid-19 may not be effective for NeoCoV IF humans were infected. 

 

There has been ongoing concern of the theoretical possibility of recombination causing co-infection of Covid-19 and MERS-CoV since bats can harbor both viruses and they are genetically related. Researchers have been actively collecting data to stay ahead of any such developments. There is also concern about potential variants of SARS-CoV (2002-2003) which had about a 10% mortality risk and also would likely evade immunity for Covid-19. Both of these illnesses left many survivors with a variety of long term health problems such as have been reported for Covid-19. 

Edited by claire, 05 February 2022 - 06:50 PM.

[Rogerdodger]

many of those who have been posting about this topic which makes them vulnerable to pseudo-scientific presentations of distorted information.

 

You are so correct. I used to believe every word coming from

Fauci's pseudo-scientific presentations of distorted information!

 

Is it "follow the Science" or Follow the Leader?

Einstein once observed that “a scientist is a mimosa when he himself has made a mistake, and a roaring lion when he discovers a mistake of others”.

The statement accurately sums up the tone of some of the current "scientific" discourse on Covid-19.

 

Such as Fauci's "mistakes":

 

Coronavirus is “not a major threat”

Cruises are OK

Malls, movies and gyms are OK

Covid closer to a Very Bad Flu.

No one needs a mask.

Yes they do.

Wear two at a time.

Stay 6 feet apart. 

Stay 16 feet apart.

Quarantine 10 days.

Quarantine 5 days.

This week Fauci announced that he might change the Covid quarantine rules yet again.

“If you’re willing to take a risk — and you know, everybody has their own tolerance for risks — you could figure out if you want to meet somebody on Tinder."

 

 

White House set for pivot on pandemic...

July 4th 2021:President Biden declared near “independence” from COVID-19

 

Scientists admit "mistakes"...

 

"We knew almost right away, when the blanket lockdown was introduced in March 2020, that children were the least at-risk group, and their education should have been preserved."

Edited by Rogerdodger, 06 February 2022 - 03:03 PM.

[claire]

 

 

You are so correct. I used to believe every word coming from

Fauci's pseudo-scientific presentations of distorted information!

 

 

 

Fauci did not make a statement about this potential variant of MERS, nor has the CDC listed it as a variant of concern. It appeared at a site called WION and has been spreading on Twitter with inflammatory distortions. Just because something could happen, it doesn't mean that it will happen. Very likely, there will continue to be variants. That's what happens. Viruses evolve, and since they replicate so quickly, they evolve quickly.  Many will be less harmful for humans and some may be more harmful. It's the reason that vigilance is critical with increased contact tracing, genomic sequencing, as well as efforts to contain the spread when/if a lethal variant occurs. 

Edited by claire, 06 February 2022 - 03:25 PM.

[Rogerdodger]

I wonder why it is recommended that people get a second opinion after a serious diagnosis from a doctor, since doctors are also infallible scientists?

 

My wife got a second opinion on her neck surgery. She went to a different doctor with a newer, much simpler, safer, less invasive surgery.

Hasn't had a problem since.

 

Scientists are actually humans who are often entrenched in the old ways of seeing and doing things one way.

It generally takes the second generation of doctors before new practices are accepted and implemented.

 

It took "scientists" a few generations to be convinced that the earth is not really all that flat.

They didn't want to even consider what Galileo saw in his newfangled invention, the telescope.

"We've no time for such newfangled nonsense."

 

Being entrenched in the politics of the day is not a scientific method.

Edited by Rogerdodger, 06 February 2022 - 06:07 PM.

[claire]

I wonder why it is recommended that people get a second opinion after a serious diagnosis from a doctor, since doctors are also infallible scientists?

 

 

Doctors are not scientists. And no scientist ever says they are infallible. Conclusions are always considered tentative, based on the current data and findings, and based on probabilities.  

 

 

Scientists are actually humans who are often entrenched in the old ways of seeing and doing things one way.

It generally takes the second generation of doctors before new practices are accepted and implemented.

 

 

Science progresses when there are new findings that are replicated with convincing data from more than one source. If every speculation were to overturn previous findings without scrupulous study, there would be chaos and not science.

 

 

It took "scientists" a few generations to be convinced that the earth is not really all that flat.

They didn't want to even consider what Galileo saw in his newfangled invention, the telescope.

"We've no time for such newfangled nonsense."

 

 

That's a myth. The ancient Greeks calculated the circumference of the Earth in 240 BC. Most educated European scholars in the early Middle Ages knew this. It was depicted in art such as in Bosch's Garden of Earthly Delights. About 100 years before Galileo's telescope, Copernicus detailed the trajectory of the planets around the sun. Galileo was accused of heresy by the Catholic Church for his  confirmation of those views, for which he was imprisoned. So, no, it was not the scientists who were not convinced. It was the politics of the day that silenced him.

 

 

Being entrenched in the politics of the day is not a scientific method.

 

 

Being entrenched in the politics of the day is being used to vilify the scientific method. 

[claire]

hhh - re the Pfizer article:

 

This coalition of doctors and other non-medically trained people claim that the Pfizer vaccine does more harm than good and that the original clinical trials were seriously flawed.

 

The article is in a format that makes it almost impossible to read anything other than the authors' interpretations and conclusions, which are written in large and bold print, with the information they critique in tiny print off to the right. I had to magnify all of it 100% and the print on the right is still almost unreadable, but my extra large screen is filled edge to edge.  This is not how any scholarly article would ever present information. 

 

There are 51 pages, so I can't go through each page to point out egregious misinterpretations of the data from Pfizer to confirm their critique. Here's one example on page 9 about unbinding the randomized control trial for Phase III of the study. They fault Pfizer for allowing vaccinations for the control group after confirmation of safety and very high rates of efficacy. This is a common procedure in clinical trials when such safety and efficacy is seen. In fact, It is considered unethical to continue to withhold treatment from the control group when this occurs - as it did during this clinical trial. They fault Pfizer for not continuing with Phase III until mid 2023, suggesting that "should" have been the end of the trial using a control group. They cite them for NO DATA for 3 years. 

 

The data is still being collected for those in the study, and the safety and efficacy still continues at the same rate as when they had the control group. If we were to wait until mid 2023 for this data before approving the vaccine, I don't dare even speculate on the increased numbers of people who would have severe illness or deaths by now and the societal chaos that would ensue, especially with the Omicron variant that is far less toxic for vaccinated people.

 

Another example on page 11. Bold print says there's an increased risk of illness with the vaccine. They are referring to adverse effects. They highlight "Severe" for which there are 0.5% more than in the placebo group. That's a nothing-burger - only so few more severe adverse effects for virtually any treatment. They also highlight "Any Serious Adverse Effect," for which there is 0.1% more cases than in the control group. Same comment applies. They ignore that the control group had twice as many adverse effects leading to withdrawal from the trial, 0.1% vs 0.2%. Also ignored from this table is that there were no life-threatening adverse effects in either group. This is not how any credible scientific data should be reported.

 

Next - page 12: Here they boldly announce an increased rate of deaths after the control group was removed. In the early phase III trial, there were 15 deaths in the vaccine group and 14 in the placebo group. Next, they say there were 5 deaths after the control group was allowed to take the vaccine. They add the original 15 and 5 and refer to 20 total deaths in the vaccine group and still count 14 for the disbanded control group. Also, they don't state the time interval for which these 5 more cases occurred and next compare this total to the 14 for the control group who no longer were controls. They still list the total for the control group at 14. If this is confusing, it should be because that's the intent.

 

Also added is that there were 9 deaths related to cardiovascular events for the vaccine and 5 in the control group. They don't mention whether this is a statistically significant difference. Also, there are errors in their addition! There are only 9 cardiac related illnesses in the list that they are totalling as 15! Check the numbers.

 

Normally, I wouldn't even read past this point in any article as presented, but it gets even worse! And they use this gobbledygook to justify their conclusions. They go on to fault Pfizer for things they couldn't possibly study and didn't intend to study or it would take at least five years while the virus continued to mutate and ravage the nation. They present alarming examples of the horror of those with severe adverse effects, all of which are far more likely to occur and do occur among the unvaccinated. There are a great many horror stories and children who have lost parents or left disabled by the Covid infection, which IS far more prevalent among the unvaccinated.

 

I can't spend more time going through the details of this article and I'm sure few have read what I've covered so far. There are good reasons that America, the world's wealthiest nation, has the highest number of deaths/100,000 people of any developed nation. Our rate of vaccination is lower than in most other high income countries as is our booster rate. About 64% of Americans are vaccinated and only 48% of those are boosted. We have 900,000 deaths now. which is probably an underestimate given the high rate of excess deaths which also has not occurred at high levels in other developed nations. How soon will the count be 1 million?

 

The boosters are especially important for Omicron and for anyone else whose immunity from natural infection or prior vaccines has waned. Also, many Americans have not followed safety protocols as well as other nations and seem especially prone to anti-science propaganda, possibly because we are far more science illiterate than other developed nations. Articles such as this one is an excellent example.